Life Expectancy of 3 in SCORE

[jonnyslick]

so how much longer do you think 3's will run in SCORE? with BITD getting rid of the class, how much longer until SCORE does the same thing?

and what about SNORE? anyone race in that series? 3's are legas for 1800 in BITD correct? if SCORE get's rid of 3's they would have to run in sportsman right?

[fj40]

This in not going to happen soon, thanks to a certain FJ CRUISER. Last race there were six participants in our class, minus the champs and 2 other broncos that always race the 500 & 1000, if you read some previus post in this forum, youll find some soon to be CLASS 3 RACERS and theres a few proyects here in Mexico also.
Just in case it did, most of the 3´s racing now in SCORE cud easily be modify to race as stock full or stock minis.

[Blanco]

I'm not an authority or anything, But I dont think SCORE will do away with Class 3.

& If this Site Can help in anyway I hope to bring back Class 3 to the others :cool:

I'm sure if the numbers grow, They'll bring it back..

So spread the word of this class to all potential Class 3 racers..
maybe if they start hanging out here & get to interact with the Racers maybe they join the Ranks! http://thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/7.gif

[fj40]

"the Brotherhood Of The Short Wheel Base"

[Blanco]

"the Broherhood Of The Short Wheel Base"

http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/181270/fullsize/lego-rally.gif

[straightaxle]

Over the last couple of years, BITD class 3000 had only one occasional entry in the class that seldom finished. That could be considered a lack of interest and a pretty good reason to drop the class. I think it was more of a loop hole in the rules that allowed 2 wheel drive that killed the class. Until they retired the truck, the Swift Explorer relegated all the 4 wheel drive vehicles to no better than second place. Who's going to show up if they don't have a shot at a win? If you could consistently promise that 5 entries would should up at each race, I think you might convince Casey to reintroduce the class. The numbers are better, but I don't think we're there yet.

[Salttoy]

As long as there are Class 3's paying the entry fee, SCORE will have a class for them.

[jonnyslick]

Yeah I'm really glad that Pig turned me onto C3 over on desertrides.com. Honestly our team has been trying to figure out what to do and have been going back and forth about what class to do or not to do ... keep the C11 or sell it ... and in all that we overlooked C3. it's totally weird b/c we all drool over this class when we're down in baja, but i think we all thought that it wasn't something obtainable for us "common guys" ... but i'm really starting to dig this class and as soon as we can unload the 11 car we're gonna' start looking for one of these to build or built.

[Blanco]

If you could consistently promise that 5 entries would should up at each race, I think you might convince Casey to reintroduce the class. The numbers are better, but I don't think we're there yet.

No not yet. But give us time! :cool:

The problem I see is that too many are just building for their other current class'es & that takes away from its future there.
& maybe it would take a race where 5 SCORE class 3's showed up to the same race or something because the guys currently racing BITD have probably already started modifing his rig to the other class rules.

[retroblazer]

so how much longer do you think 3's will run in SCORE? with BITD getting rid of the class, how much longer until SCORE does the same thing?

and what about SNORE? anyone race in that series? 3's are legas for 1800 in BITD correct? if SCORE get's rid of 3's they would have to run in sportsman right?

Don't forget about MDR. The race I did with them a few weeks ago had four entries in Class 300. MDR uses the same rules as SCORE, but they had been allowing 2wd's to run as well.

[jonnyslick]

well like i said we got to get ride of our 11 ride first. then when we start building it will be by SCORE rules. at least we could do SCORE, MDR, and some class in BITD i'm sure ... and maybe even SNORE(?) ... i really enjoy the SNORE races.

[pigracing]

With out organizing the efforts of the current racers I'd say this class may continue to limp on for awhile and eventually desolve entirely.

However now that we have this board I think we have an excellent chance of really getting some stuff together and pushing the class.
Now we all have a collective voice which at the very least screams this class aint dead yet.

Just a thought but if we could get all of the current racers to agree on running one race together in each sanctioning bodies over the next season then maybe we could start turning some heads. I mean as it is right now you see maybe a couple class 3's at any one race and to anyone lucky enough to have even noticed them it's really un-impressive. As for the people that did notice now they may even be turned off by the low entries as that's a sure sign of a weak/dying class.
Now you get 10 of these class 3's together and you got yourself a nice race and maybe enough to start getting noticed again and hopefully by getting a big turn out in each sanctioning body (even if just one race) then we're making sure to get noticed by everyone.

I don't just my thoughs.

[tattoodan]

Get Ready!

You Will All See The Blue Chevy Next Season !!!!! :d

[Blanco]

Its easy for someone as my self that dont actually race or have to deal with all the logistics of it..

But I agree this Site was created with a loose plan in mind... http://thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/shrug.gif

Can we save Class 3 & get it to grow?

I'd say yes! :D

But what do we need to do?

I do like the Idea of trying to originize one race per race Sanctions.

& that would probably make a difference to the Fan base, that unexpected to see a bunch of SCORE legal Class 3's show up at a race!

But results could not be promised..

With a thought out promotional plan I bet it could work.
But how many of you are willing to commit to the cause & not back out later? :confused:

If nothing else it would be fun to try..

OK maybe I do need to consider making more stickers & hats or?

We Need to hear from the actual racers & get their suggestons.. http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/humm_smilie.gif

[Moss2]

As long as there are Class 3's paying the entry fee, SCORE will have a class for them.

That is all it takes I think. When a few rally types show up for the 1000 they even make up a class 3i (international class). Some are pretty fast.

Hey nice couple of trucks in the avatar Salttoy!! I would like a copy of that one sometime.

[Blanco]

Class 3i That sounds http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/awesome_dude.gif
When was the last time that happened? :confused:

[straightaxle]

It's been a couple of years since there was a 3i entry, but SCORE is not bashful about creating a class for entries that don't fit, since all entries (except for sportsman) pay the same entry fee.

Speaking of fees, the idea of taking a group of Class 3's to several other sanctioning bodies is a good one. Just be sure to factor in the costs of the fees. Each organization requires that the driver and riders pay membership dues (currently $75 each at SCORE) and there may be a vehicle registration fee. At SCORE that is essentially the $250 inspection fee. SCORE also requires that you rent a Rally Tracker device for each race. This is all before you have paid the race entry fee or fuel to get to the race. Sorry, having just turned in my tax forms, I'm feeling a little sensitive to costs......... At least with circle track racing they would pay back enough to cover the entry fee as long as you finished the race when you traveled to an open show. The disadvantage for not having paying spectators at off road races.

[jonnyslick]

Another thing that could really push the class is to try to get involvement in a magazine. I know some people with contacts at Dirt Sport ... maybe we could come up with a Class 3 build for the mag? Then again ... they may laugh at the idea. I'll make some calls and let you know by Friday if I've found out anything.

[pigracing]

Another thing that could really push the class is to try to get involvement in a magazine. I know some people with contacts at Dirt Sport ... maybe we could come up with a Class 3 build for the mag? Then again ... they may laugh at the idea. I'll make some calls and let you know by Friday if I've found out anything.

An article in a mag would be huge. Didn't dirtsports even have a couple write ups about an old full size bronco they were reviving? Maybe they could bring that out and race with the class?

Speaking of fees, the idea of taking a group of Class 3's to several other sanctioning bodies is a good one. Just be sure to factor in the costs of the fees. Each organization requires that the driver and riders pay membership dues (currently $75 each at SCORE) and there may be a vehicle registration fee. At SCORE that is essentially the $250 inspection fee. SCORE also requires that you rent a Rally Tracker device for each race. This is all before you have paid the race entry fee or fuel to get to the race. Sorry, having just turned in my tax forms, I'm feeling a little sensitive to costs......... At least with circle track racing they would pay back enough to cover the entry fee as long as you finished the race when you traveled to an open show. The disadvantage for not having paying spectators at off road races.

Yeah I thought that might be an issue. I suppose we would try to ease some of the cost if we leverage all of our resources together. Maybe one big pit for everyone that we could all help at?
This would also help a lot of us future racers see what it really takes and such.

[retroblazer]

Group pitting will work in the shorter loop races. Normally there isn't that much to do, but it never hurts to have people around that you know. The long races are tough. I'm always willing to share my radio frequencies, but it's not practical to carry spares for others in chase trucks. It is possible to set up some stationary pits, particularly if we have some non-racers who want to be involved.

[Blanco]

I'm kinda in with the Guys @ BroncoDriver Magazine & we even have a member here Toddz69 that writes for them & I also have Manny over on TWW that also writes for them.

That could have some influence..

Being most class 3 are Broncos helps us with them printing our stuff! :D

But if everyone is HardCore enough about this I could start an account just for potential Class 3 fundage to help the racers out & keep a tally posted as to what we have towards contributing to the guys racing at other sancitions. http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/shrug.gif

You guys let me know.....:cool:

You can all post what you donate & so it will all be public knowledge in whats in our bank & I'll have it in it's own bank account to help get Class 3 out to other events building attention to our cause...


Like I said before I started this Site with Building up The Class in mind!
So Use C3R in any ways That Will Hopefully work!

[petepecas]

Hi guys,
I'm really excited to hear that class 3 ain't dead, I raced TWO races in '97 San Felipe 250 and Baja 500 in #351 Black Blazer, (sportsman class 3 back then).
Finished the 250 and DNF at around MI 150 or so on the 500.

Any way, life got in the way and I had to settle for road racing in a 914 for a couple of years, it was fun, but too easy.... but I'm getting the bug again and pulling the old blazer out of the warehouse to freshen it for the 40th. 1000, so hope to see you all there, rumors are going about it starting in Tijuana, any one knows?

[Blanco]

Hi guys,
I'm really excited to hear that class 3 ain't dead, I raced TWO races in '97 San Felipe 250 and Baja 500 in #351 Black Blazer, (sportsman class 3 back then).
Finished the 250 and DNF at around MI 150 or so on the 500.

Any way, life got in the way and I had to settle for road racing in a 914 for a couple of years, it was fun, but too easy.... but I'm getting the bug again and pulling the old blazer out of the warehouse to freshen it for the 40th. 1000, so hope to see you all there, rumors are going about it starting in Tijuana, any one knows?
This would been better placed in our Introductions area. :rolleyes:

Oh well...

I've always liked them 914's.
Maybe if you start a intro tread you could post a Pic of it?

Glad to here your gonna get back to class 3 :D

[chupakabras]

Hi guys,
rumors are going about it starting in Tijuana, any one knows?

kind of a party will be held at tijuana, it will be part of the baja 1000 celebrations, but the race will start at ensenada,

ps.. cool your'e getting back to racing at baja, keep on working on your racer.. see yahh then..

[retroblazer]

Hi guys,
I'm really excited to hear that class 3 ain't dead, I raced TWO races in '97 San Felipe 250 and Baja 500 in #351 Black Blazer, (sportsman class 3 back then).
Finished the 250 and DNF at around MI 150 or so on the 500.

Any way, life got in the way and I had to settle for road racing in a 914 for a couple of years, it was fun, but too easy.... but I'm getting the bug again and pulling the old blazer out of the warehouse to freshen it for the 40th. 1000, so hope to see you all there, rumors are going about it starting in Tijuana, any one knows?

The will be ceremonies in TJ, but the race itself will start in Ensenada. Interesting, the 914 was the first car to leave a major impression on me. My friends dad a one in 1971. It was a puny 1.7, but I fell in love with it. The first time he took me for a ride he hit a circular off ramp at double the posted speed limit. That was it, I was hooked, bad. Hope to see you at the 1000. Post some pictures if you can.

[OldGreen]

OK, bringing this thread back from the dead.

There are two really cool things about Class 3 (other than the tech).

1. History of the class
2. Crossover to mainstream wheelers

I think, from a marketing standpoint, that this group can leverage #2. Think about it. . .people really dig being able to relate to racer's rides. Most people outside of the Southwest would never even consider going off-road with a long wheelbase, 2wd vehicle. It is just plain stupid. . .YET. . .what are all the fast guys driving. . .TT and Cl1 cars that are all very difficult to relate to regardless of how cool they are. There is an attempt to market "brands" (Chevy/Ford/etc) buy requiring the TTs to have some sort of body on them. . but still. If you sit on the side of the track at a place like Parker, the spectators are all in wheelin' rigs like Jeeps and Broncos and Toyotas. . .so, there is the market.

Now, a few of you have said you know people in the magazine business. I actually am a freelance writer for Crawl Magazine (rock crawling and trail riding, but they do a writeup on the B1K as well) and I have a contact at one of the large 4wd rags as well. . .I am willing to leverage my contacts to do a series on a Class 3 build-up, but, at the same time, we should place some focus on the other publications out there. I think that it would be really easy to put some emphasis on the class (again) if we all work together.

As I have contemplated getting back into racing, I have thought of other classes to enter. . .Jeepspeed, 7s, 9, 1/2 1600, 5, etc. . .but I just can't consider anything but a SWB 4x4 because that is what off road IS to me!!!

[straightaxle]

OK, bringing this thread back from the dead.

There are two really cool things about Class 3 (other than the tech).

1. History of the class
2. Crossover to mainstream wheelers

I think, from a marketing standpoint, that this group can leverage #2. Think about it. . .people really dig being able to relate to racer's rides. Most people outside of the Southwest would never even consider going off-road with a long wheelbase, 2wd vehicle. It is just plain stupid. . .YET. . .what are all the fast guys driving. . .TT and Cl1 cars that are all very difficult to relate to regardless of how cool they are. There is an attempt to market "brands" (Chevy/Ford/etc) buy requiring the TTs to have some sort of body on them. . but still. If you sit on the side of the track at a place like Parker, the spectators are all in wheelin' rigs like Jeeps and Broncos and Toyotas. . .so, there is the market.

Now, a few of you have said you know people in the magazine business. I actually am a freelance writer for Crawl Magazine (rock crawling and trail riding, but they do a writeup on the B1K as well) and I have a contact at one of the large 4wd rags as well. . .I am willing to leverage my contacts to do a series on a Class 3 build-up, but, at the same time, we should place some focus on the other publications out there. I think that it would be really easy to put some emphasis on the class (again) if we all work together.

As I have contemplated getting back into racing, I have thought of other classes to enter. . .Jeepspeed, 7s, 9, 1/2 1600, 5, etc. . .but I just can't consider anything but a SWB 4x4 because that is what off road IS to me!!!

I would have to agree with you on those points, the Class 3's are like belly buttons, everyone has one. I get at least 10 people that come up to me in race contingency and tell me they have a Bronco or F100 of some vintage. At least 2 or 3 will crawl all over the truck, taking pictures, etc. My problem is I am already spending more time than I really have to get our truck out there. The rest of my time is spent on my real job so that I can pay for the racing. We would like to contribute what we can.

[Blanco]

2. Crossover to mainstream wheelers

Thats why I started this Site! :)

I figured theres gotta be enough of us already driving these rigs that would see the attraction to the class.

I cant say I'm tight with BroncoDriver Mag but do have some frineds there that would probably be happy to jump on this.

BroncoDriver may be a small grass roots Magazine but its completely in the niche.

& I have few other friends in with mag peeps too...

But I think if we can gather our thoughts here we can have a well prepped presentation for them. :)

[151FAB]

I think if there is going to be a future (other than a half dozen entries) you will see it in the new small SUV market. The FJ, Xterra type vehicles that are popular now already have ads touting there hipness with the younger generation. Now that the fuel prices have forced out the Excursion and lowered the sales of Suburbans and such, this would be a prime time to get Toyota and Nissan along with Jeep (Liberty) and Ford(Escape) to realize the potential for exposure with a little investment.

With the hybrids getting more and more powerful; one might get a little factory backing by offering to field a hybrid vehicle. This class is the only class that there is a direct availability for a manufacturer to do that with a currently marketed vehicle. Score and the other racing bodies would be wise to encourage this as well; to appease the tree-huggers out to end our land use. VW raced with diesel, why not bio-diesel?

VW may have done Class3 the biggest favor by entering the Baja500; they showed what a factory sponsored team is capable of again and may have sparked interest in the hearts of all those who own awd/4x4 grocery-getters. Now if we could just take that momentum and show the world a cheaper class to enter their Tourages into...

Don't get me wrong; I'm a huge fan of the Bronco, K5, etc but the interest from the general public in this class isn't going to grow if we don't field a fleet of new vehicles.

[OldGreen]

As food for thought, most of the non-crossover SUVs and even some of the crossovers (Touraeg for example) don't meet the C3 wheelbase rules. On the other hand, a 4 wheel independent like an escape or the small rover could be a fun ride!!!

I do agree with the point of going mainstream IF you want to get factories involved as sponsors.

[151FAB]

Yeah, I understand that not all of those mini-suvs can race but my point is that some of the hottest selling models out there are class3 applicable and it seems as though that would make class3 ripe for expansion and OEM sponsors.

Heck, we could get Al Gore to do a documentory about running the Baja1000 in a hybrid Ford Escape, Leonardo DeCaprio could produce it.:D :D

[Blanco]

I must agree we need new'er rigs if we want bigger attention..

Never mind the V-Dubs..

The best thing we have going right now is the FJ.

Just look at all the press its getting!

If the Moss Bronco was a new rig it would be ON!

But the buying market aint out there looking to buy old Broncos..

& if you remember way back when...... The mentality of the BIG 3 was race on sunday, Sell on monday!

I'm sure a few have already bought FJ's because of Dylans win. http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/m2c.gif

I personally aint crazy about to many of the new things offer'ed to us these days..

But then again there thousands of people driving the older Broncos, Blazers etc..... that if we can get them pumped might start building...

Heck just since we started this site I've seen at least a few guys posting that now they're considering going with a class 3.. :D

[jonnyslick]

ok so that brings up a good question ... what NEW vehicles that you could go down to the lot and pick up right now are good to go for class 3?

[151FAB]

Here's the list from this site:

http://www.class3racing.com/showthread.php?t=76

[retroblazer]

A small reminder to those of you who believe that "factory involvement" is needed for the growth of this class. Forget it. I understand that five or six shops bid for the FJ deal. Yes, I said shops, not home garage operations. Who of you out there think you have the qualifications to run a factory program? Who of you have a driver's record, with the exception of Mosses, that would warrant factory involvement? Back to reality.
Personally, I would like to see a radical revision to the rules. Where all makes are on a fairly equal footing. To start, all trucks should be able to run at the maximum wheel base and width. Jeeps and EB's should be able to stretch to the 108" limit. FJ's and other narrow vehicles should be able to run 82-84" wide. The springing should be open on the front and rear. And everybody should be able to run a V-8. It's that simple gang.

[straightaxle]

A small reminder to those of you who believe that "factory involvement" is needed for the growth of this class. Forget it. I understand that five or six shops bid for the FJ deal. Yes, I said shops, not home garage operations. Who of you out there think you have the qualifications to run a factory program? Who of you have a driver's record, with the exception of Mosses, that would warrant factory involvement? Back to reality.
Personally, I would like to see a radical revision to the rules. Where all makes are on a fairly equal footing. To start, all trucks should be able to run at the maximum wheel base and width. Jeeps and EB's should be able to stretch to the 108" limit. FJ's and other narrow vehicles should be able to run 82-84" wide. The springing should be open on the front and rear. And everybody should be able to run a V-8. It's that simple gang.

Chris, with the exception of the wheelbase limit, you have described the Class 8 rules, they even have the option of running 2 or 4 wheel drive. Up until recently, Class 8 has had the same or fewer entries than class 3, the open and equal rules have not caused that class to grow. Right now, Class 3 is fortunate to have 100% more factory involvement than Class 8, and in no way will I rain on that! Whether factory support is "needed" or not, it sure brings attention to it, and it provided 25% of the entries in or class at the last race.

Class sizes will fluctuate up and down, but it takes years for this to happen. I have also said I would very much prefer that the class was larger, but short of building the guy's truck for him and paying his entry fee, it takes some very dedicated individuals to make the effort. We entered a bunch of races 5 or 6 years ago and ran by ourselves, just to make sure the class kept going, Savage himself said to me "Class 3 needs to go away". We can help them with the encouragement and motivational part, but the cycle will move at its own pace. An example is class 7SX. It was the red headed step child a couple of years ago. Class 7S, which they spawned from, will be gone by the end of the year, maybe temporarily, maybe forever, but in any case, 7SX had a dozen entries at the 500.

[jonnyslick]

Chris, with the exception of the wheelbase limit, you have described the Class 8 rules, they even have the option of running 2 or 4 wheel drive. Up until recently, Class 8 has had the same or fewer entries than class 3, the open and equal rules have not caused that class to grow. Right now, Class 3 is fortunate to have 100% more factory involvement than Class 8, and in no way will I rain on that! Whether factory support is "needed" or not, it sure brings attention to it, and it provided 25% of the entries in or class at the last race.

Class sizes will fluctuate up and down, but it takes years for this to happen. I have also said I would very much prefer that the class was larger, but short of building the guy's truck for him and paying his entry fee, it takes some very dedicated individuals to make the effort. We entered a bunch of races 5 or 6 years ago and ran by ourselves, just to make sure the class kept going, Savage himself said to me "Class 3 needs to go away". We can help them with the encouragement and motivational part, but the cycle will move at its own pace. An example is class 7SX. It was the red headed step child a couple of years ago. Class 7S, which they spawned from, will be gone by the end of the year, maybe temporarily, maybe forever, but in any case, 7SX had a dozen entries at the 500.

^ i totally agree with that!

[151FAB]

Factory involvement will help the class, not necessarily the home garage based competitor but definitely the class as a whole. Plus, with factory involvement there usually comes more contingency money.

[retroblazer]

First, I would agree that the rules changes would mimic the Class 8 rules structure. Meaning, that the rules look at the idea of "stock or production" in the same perspective.
Wheelbase and width, with working 4wd still define Class 3. The basic feel of Class 3 won't change with these modifications. With an equalized rules base, every brand has the same shot. This is the truck class that guys can build for nationally. This is the type of truck the average guy is building already. A Jeep with a linked suspension and a small block. It's easy and available everywhere. Short course or desert.
We know that wheelbase is a critical parameter. Give everybody the max. Why not? Same for width.
Ditch leaf springs for everyone, set us free !!!!!. Coil-overs for all!!! Front and back. You can't see them from the outside. No one knows but us... This is stupid. Why are we limiting ourselves! It's cheaper and easier than leaf springs. The after market is ready to embrace this by offering readily available link kits for our trucks. If the rules are open to this degree I would like to see front wheel travel limited on a-armed cars to 12" and everything else at 15". Why?, because we,at least for awhile, want to preserve the competitive balance between straight axles and and a-arms.

[Blanco]

Dont we already have another thread that there for disscussing rule changes? :rolleyes:

[retroblazer]

Dont we already have another thread that there for disscussing rule changes? :rolleyes:

You should be posting pictures from the race..... No more excuses, by the way, did you take off with my inverter?

[Blanco]

did you take off with my inverter?

Yeah Sorry, I do have it. :o

I realized it when I was taking things out of the jeep to put in my Car..

I'll give it back to you at Primm.....http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/paperbag.gif

I've posted all the Pics I had already.

I wanted to get pics from before the start line & such But by the time I got there you guys took off the line & then we headed out to get stuff & started heading out to chase for you. :)
& Unfortunitly being just me & chris in our chase crew I could'nt Take pics while doing what had to be done at the stops.

[shadow]

waaaaaaah where you an only child. man class 3 is class 3 change class if you don't like it. I am confused as to why your asking for the changes. we just want class 3 to continue and grow with good fun friendly competition. your welcome to change to another class if your not happy.
I think the average guy who is trying to juggle work family and still enjoy the off road experience on a competative level is where this class's heart is. leave it alone. Is your truck in your garage and working on it after the kids are in bed and your honey is sitting on a milk crate ready to bandage your knuckles or your buddy is swapping dorkey stories with you while wrenching one end and you another. Big Sponsorship is great and does bring attention But it may also keep joe average from trying. Besides, if you have NO Xpense spared mentality some of the challenge is taken away and lowers the pride of the effort or win. the only thing that could help peak interest is a bigger paycheck at the end. Push for that, and work on more contingency because plaques don't pay bills. Other then that LEAVE CLASS 3 ALONE.

SO to the little guy doing it HIGH 5 I am proud of you, your crews and families. And to anyone thinking....come join a special group of people.
LETS GET IT ON!!

[retroblazer]

waaaaaaah where you an only child. man class 3 is class 3 change class if you don't like it. I am confused as to why your asking for the changes. we just want class 3 to continue and grow with good fun friendly competition. your welcome to change to another class if your not happy.
I think the average guy who is trying to juggle work family and still enjoy the off road experience on a competative level is where this class's heart is. leave it alone. Is your truck in your garage and working on it after the kids are in bed and your honey is sitting on a milk crate ready to bandage your knuckles or your buddy is swapping dorkey stories with you while wrenching one end and you another. Big Sponsorship is great and does bring attention But it may also keep joe average from trying. Besides, if you have NO Xpense spared mentality some of the challenge is taken away and lowers the pride of the effort or win. the only thing that could help peak interest is a bigger paycheck at the end. Push for that, and work on more contingency because plaques don't pay bills. Other then that LEAVE CLASS 3 ALONE.

SO to the little guy doing it HIGH 5 I am proud of you, your crews and families. And to anyone thinking....come join a special group of people.
LETS GET IT ON!!

Some can talk the talk, some can walk the walk. You do neither. You say you don't understand why the rules changes are requested? Have you looked at the number of entries in the last five years? Do you catch the basic drift that the suggested rules will allow a larger competitive base of cars and not just favor a single brand advantage? Did you know that the rules that we race under in Class 3 are not the same rules we had forty years ago?

[Moss2]

Some can talk the talk, some can walk the walk. You do neither. You say you don't understand why the rules changes are requested? Have you looked at the number of entries in the last five years? Do you catch the basic drift that the suggested rules will allow a larger competitive base of cars and not just favor a single brand advantage? Did you know that the rules that we race under in Class 3 are not the same rules we had forty years ago?

If you really feel that it will bring that kind of numbers Chris then quit messing around with the 4 or 5 owners in class 3 now that are resisting you and build a new class. You have done it before right? ( I dont need the story again) You stated before that a guy had a Blazer ready to go with a link/coil front end. Enter that sucker in Sportsman or whatever and show us how it should be done. From what I read of your rules suggestions it sounds like a SWB 4wd trophy truck class with open motor manufacturer. Why keep a stock frame? Are you going to put in a rule that specifically excludes big manufacturer backing? What happened to your emphatic screams that 'nobody' was talking about anything but a simple spring change for the front? Don't get me wrong your suggestion sounds like fun but if your thinking you can compete low budget you'll still be in the back of the pack.

[retroblazer]

I have suggested a couple of different paths for rules changes. One evolutionary the other revolutionary. I'm not optimistic that my more radical ideas of having a more equal platform is going to take in the near term. We have a small chance at any changes being made. The status quo is always hard to move. Especially when it benefits those in place already.
I have nothing against large manufacturers participating in our class. I just know I'm not going to be one to get their help. Just as it did with the FJ, the "support" is going to go to a very limited few. All one has to do is look at the history of this issue. Pick almost any factory involvement in SCORE and it easily demonstrates my point. Why have you guys gotten any factory help? Your record certainly deserves it.
Why keep a stock frame? For the same reason Class 8 does... it's keeps the production element. In spite of your repeated referecence to Trophy Trucks, this class is no differerent than any other open production based class. You can say they're all mini trophy trucks if you want.
One way or another, we have to get more entries. And yes, I am convinced that we need open the playing field. We need more than Fords and a single Toyota showing up. And since you're no longer full time, well, I think you should be a little more open minded. None of these rules will dimish the competiveness of your truck. Enjoy the rest of the weekend. I know you're doing the 1000, how about Primm?

[shadow]

Some can talk the talk, some can walk the walk. You do neither. You say you don't understand why the rules changes are requested? Have you looked at the number of entries in the last five years? Do you catch the basic drift that the suggested rules will allow a larger competitive base of cars and not just favor a single brand advantage? Did you know that the rules that we race under in Class 3 are not the same rules we had forty years ago?

AAHHH Shot thru the heart and your to blame... you give racing a bad name.
(bad humor sorry)

I guess the point that I was making and what the others are making is going right over your head.

Are you mad cause what your doing isn't working for you. (At least not in the score races.) hit once hit twice hit three times duhhh. Stop and think things thru and fix what isn't working. Something is going to happen at every race thats part of the challenge. Good planning, a great crew and yeah a little lady luck is all part of it. Seeing how the Moss bros. run their show, well they are walking and talking it. they have been at this along time. they don't like getting hit. They take great notes! That is why they Ace the class. please stay in the class we need you. Do modifications within the rules, Smile and race.

besides are you asking me to run this class. do I have to do it in a Chevy or do I get my choice.

[petepecas]

AAHHH Shot thru the heart and your to blame... you give racing a bad name.
(bad humor sorry)

I guess the point that I was making and what the others are making is going right over your head.

Are you mad cause what your doing isn't working for you. (At least not in the score races.) hit once hit twice hit three times duhhh. Stop and think things thru and fix what isn't working. Something is going to happen at every race thats part of the challenge. Good planning, a great crew and yeah a little lady luck is all part of it. Seeing how the Moss bros. run their show, well they are walking and talking it. they have been at this along time. they don't like getting hit. They take great notes! That is why they Ace the class. please stay in the class we need you. Do modifications within the rules, Smile and race.

besides are you asking me to run this class. do I have to do it in a Chevy or do I get my choice.

You know...you are so right, I saw that blazer up close and it does need refurbishing....