15 or 17 and BS?

[Yikes]

Given a full size Class 3 Bronco, would you run a 15" or 17" rim? .....stick with 15's if running 35's? Give me some input. I've observed many vehicles (not class 3's)running 17's with 35's, which has me wondering if the added sidewall with a 15 has much value at Class 3 speeds. Perhaps the 17/35 combo delivers noticeably better handling?????

Edit: Rather than lengthening the beams to the maximum allowed in the rules, I was thinking of sticking with the stock width to reduce cost. After a talk with Rodd Fantelli, I have to agree that having the ability to swap stock axles versus custom has alot of merit, but in conjunction with that I've been considering another 1" of offset to gain as much as possible. The question is - Would running 3" backspacing on an 8.5 wide rim create enough additional load on the bearings to be a concern?

[Moss2]

Unless you need the extra room for bigger brakes I would stick with the 15". A lot of the flats I have had were pinches of sidewall between rock and rim and I think 17" wheels would make that more common for me. I dont know if there is any handling advantage. The Baja TA is a pretty stiff tire so they handle better than your standard marshmallow 35s. You also might check the price difference sometimes the bigger rim tires are ridiculously more. I guess the Bead is expensive to make?? Or are they just taking advantage of the big wheel craze to make more money??

[Yikes]

Unless you need the extra room for bigger brakes I would stick with the 15". A lot of the flats I have had were pinches of sidewall between rock and rim and I think 17" wheels would make that more common for me. I dont know if there is any handling advantage. The Baja TA is a pretty stiff tire so they handle better than your standard marshmallow 35s. You also might check the price difference sometimes the bigger rim tires are ridiculously more. I guess the Bead is expensive to make?? Or are they just taking advantage of the big wheel craze to make more money??

Pinch flats are all I need to hear. I've done that with TSL's at 20mph...albeit they were at 12psi. Thanks for the input. Did you see the second part of the question?

[roach]

i second that. you need big rims to clear big brakes. stick with your 15's and save your cash. as far as extending your beams, dont worry about swapping axles. why does everyone think they are going to break axles??? how about installing a set or warn fuse hubs. they are designed to break before a U-joint does. and i am pretty sure you will break a U-joint before an axle. the fuse's are fairly cheap and small enough to carry spares. not only that, you can change one in minutes instead of the hours it takes for an axle.

[roach]

here you go..........

http://www.warn.com/truck/axles/hub_fuse.shtml

[Blanco]

Currently my 35X12.50X15's rub on my radius arm when I turn full lock to the left (or right I forget?}

So I do plan on eventually moving to a 15" set of American racing Teflon coated Mojaves with a slightly better backspace..

& yeah stay with 15's 35's it will save you money..

You know when you go above 35 the price practically doubles & I bet its similar with 17's

[Moss2]

Currently my 35X12.50X15's rub on my radius arm when I turn full lock to the left (or right I forget?}

So I do plan on eventually moving to a 15" set of American racing Teflon coated Mojaves with a slightly better backspace..

& yeah stay with 15's 35's it will save you money..

You know when you go above 35 the price practically doubles & I bet its similar with 17's

Maybe you already tried but why not just adjust the stops on the back of the spindles. Sometimes they are broke or missing causing rubbing. Your u joints and spider gears will like it better not turning so sharp and getting locked on the radius arm. Moving the wheels out will make the rubbing at the wheel well openings worse if you already have issues there. Stock Ford alloys are tougher than most aftermarket wheels.

[Blanco]

Maybe you already tried but why not just adjust the stops on the back of the spindles. Sometimes they are broke or missing causing rubbing. Your u joints and spider gears will like it better not turning so sharp and getting locked on the radius arm. Moving the wheels out will make the rubbing at the wheel well openings worse if you already have issues there. Stock Ford alloys are tougher than most aftermarket wheels.

No rubbing anywhere besides on one side at full lock.
If changing the back spacing will cause out side well rubbing I think my new AutoFab Fenders will solve any possible rubbing issues...

But thanks for your advice, I will look into the stops....

[Yikes]

i second that. you need big rims to clear big brakes. stick with your 15's and save your cash. as far as extending your beams, dont worry about swapping axles. why does everyone think they are going to break axles??? how about installing a set or warn fuse hubs. they are designed to break before a U-joint does. and i am pretty sure you will break a U-joint before an axle. the fuse's are fairly cheap and small enough to carry spares. not only that, you can change one in minutes instead of the hours it takes for an axle.

I've never seen the fuse. That's a great idea. As far as breaking axles, it's common with the TTB D44 when rock crawling. Low range compounds the torque through the drivetrain, which combined with any decent crawling tire and a 6000lb rig is too much load for the spindly little D44. Typically, if a u-joint breaks, it will damage one and sometimes both ends of the axle along with it.

Now, I realize that you're typically not running low range for a desert rig, but I was considering bigger horsepower numbers, "air braking" and the constant on the gas/off the gas cycles. The fuse will take care of that. Do you run it?

[Yikes]

So I do plan on eventually moving to a 15" set of American racing Teflon coated Mojaves with a slightly better backspace..



I like the Mojaves too, but the backspacing IIRC is 4". What is the backspacing on the factory Alcoas?

[roach]

I've never seen the fuse. That's a great idea. As far as breaking axles, it's common with the TTB D44 when rock crawling. Low range compounds the torque through the drivetrain, which combined with any decent crawling tire and a 6000lb rig is too much load for the spindly little D44. Typically, if a u-joint breaks, it will damage one and sometimes both ends of the axle along with it.

Now, I realize that you're typically not running low range for a desert rig, but I was considering bigger horsepower numbers, "air braking" and the constant on the gas/off the gas cycles. The fuse will take care of that. Do you run it?

i dont have them yet, but we will not hit the dirt without them!

[straightaxle]

Like Roach said, you need big wheels to fit big brakes. The 15's are a little tight around the stock front calipers, and we get a lot of gravel between the wheel and caliper, but so far it has never caused a wheel to lock. Bigger brakes would be nice, but the stockers seem to work OK, not great, just OK. You also have the availability issues, 15's are pretty common, whether you are buying or selling. Ken has changed more flats than I have........ How about if you were running 37's and 17's?

All of the front axle failures we have had were related to the u-joints. The rock crawler guys already know this, but if you use the stock c-clips to retain the u-joint cups, they tend to fall out. The cups work their way out and then you have instant disaster when they catch on the ball joints. Use full circle clips. We use solid hubs. A fuse joint would sure be a lot faster to change than an axle. As far as custom axles, if you plan on racing on a regular basis, I consider axles as consumables. Factor that into the economics.

Other than this is a wheel thread, how come nobody's mentioned spider gears? I can pave my driveway with used and broken gears. Would like to find a way around that issue.

[Blanco]

I like the Mojaves too, but the backspacing IIRC is 4". What is the backspacing on the factory Alcoas?

I'm pretty confident that the Factory B/S is 3.75

& whats "air braking" :confused:

[Yikes]

I'm pretty confident that the Factory B/S is 3.75

& whats "air braking" :confused:

I'm talking about getting on the brakes when you're in the air and landing locked up........the shock of that through the drivetrain.

[fj40]

Or the other way around.... landing whit your foot in the gas.

[Blanco]

Or the other way around.... landing whit your foot in the gas.

FARTING? :confused: Air gassing? http://bestsmileys.com/lol/5.gif

[Yikes]

FARTING? :confused: Air gassing? http://bestsmileys.com/lol/5.gif

If you're landing with your foot on the brakes, your cheeks are usually squeezed too tight to let one out! :D

[3amigo]

I've never seen the fuse. That's a great idea. As far as breaking axles, it's common with the TTB D44 when rock crawling. Low range compounds the torque through the drivetrain, which combined with any decent crawling tire and a 6000lb rig is too much load for the spindly little D44. Typically, if a u-joint breaks, it will damage one and sometimes both ends of the axle along with it.

Now, I realize that you're typically not running low range for a desert rig, but I was considering bigger horsepower numbers, "air braking" and the constant on the gas/off the gas cycles. The fuse will take care of that. Do you run it?

Myself and my crawling buddies went away from the fuse. We found that when the fuse went the shock loads often damaged the shafts and or the differential. I prefer warn premium hubs and 4340 shafts with ctm joints. Seems like a certain black bronco likes that set up as well.
I also found that the new 260 joints are way stronger than the old 297's for the 44. If you do nothing else put in the 260, they only cost $20 or so.

[Grimm]

On a similar topic....What width of wheel/rim would you run. 8 or 10". I'm going with 15" rim and 35x12.5 inch tires.

[Blanco]

On a similar topic....What width of wheel/rim would you run. 8 or 10". I'm going with 15" rim and 35x12.5 inch tires.

I know you probably prefer info from the Racers, But I've been running a 15X7.5 since I got my Bronco & have had great luck running my 12.50 tires. ( 33's & 35's )

The narrower rim is said to grab the tire Better, for example when in the slow crawler sorta stuff you should be able to air down more without bead locks with out breaking a bead because of how the narrower rim is forced to hold the rim tighter than a 10" rim would.

[jonnyslick]

^ yeah most desert guys run a 8 inch rims .. where as mudders then to run 10 inchs or wider ... i think mud guys run wider rims to aid for better floation. i asked a similar question over on desertrides.com and got a similar answer. i was worried about running a 12.50 tire on a 8 inch rim since the manufacture suggested a 10 inch rim, but a lot of people use the 8 inch combo with no problems.

[RelentlessPursuitRacing]

On a similar topic....What width of wheel/rim would you run. 8 or 10". I'm going with 15" rim and 35x12.5 inch tires.

definately 8" rims...unless you are going to run bead locks.....but even then, personaly I would run the 8's over the 10's.

[roach]

the thinner rim will tuck the sidewalls in. less side wall puncures from those rocks!!

[Yikes]

Alright. Just to make sure everyone remembers. I've got to buy wheels! My steel wheels have suffered too many hits in the rocks and too many bottom-outs from jumping with.......well, less than ideal suspension. Two wheels are bent. The rig is due for rubber, so the wheels are getting swapped as well.

Q1: I can get Walker Evans 15x8's to my door for $325 each with whatever backspacing I want. Is there a better alternative? Meaning same quality, lower price.

Q2: As another lower cosr alternative, is there a company that manufactures non-beadlock aluminum wheels with custom backspacing?

[jonnyslick]

What about American Racing's? I see a lot of guys running those and for around $115 each that's a hard price to beat. I'd like to have a set.

For the price of the Walker Evans you can get Champion Beadlocks:

http://www.championwheel.com/offroadwheels.htm

[Yikes]

What about American Racing's? I see a lot of guys running those and for around $115 each that's a hard price to beat. I'd like to have a set.

For the price of the Walker Evans you can get Champion Beadlocks:

http://www.championwheel.com/offroadwheels.htm

Yeah, I've been looking at the Champions too. The price is about the same to my door, so it really comes down to quality/strength. Which American Racing wheels are you referring to?

[jonnyslick]

Yeah, I've been looking at the Champions too. The price is about the same to my door, so it really comes down to quality/strength. Which American Racing wheels are you referring to?


i was refering to the Baja's .. which the champion beadlocks are built on:


http://www.wheelsforless.com/search_result.asp?Description=Special&Product_ID=AR17258

^ on sale there this month for $86, but don't know anything about that company or their reputation.

you can also get the teflon coated mojave for $165

http://www.wheelsforless.com/search_result.asp?Product_ID=398158

[Blanco]

I can get Walker Evans 15x8's to my door for $325 each
:eek: Must be nice to even be able to consider that price range..
I'd think you could spent that money somewhere else, & just run some factory forged aluminum wheels for now...

I dont know what sorta income you have but if the moneys not that big of an issue, I'd get the Bead locks. http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/m2c.gif

[Yikes]

:eek: Must be nice to even be able to consider that price range..
I'd think you could spent that money somewhere else, & just run some factory forged aluminum wheels for now...

I dont know what sorta income you have but if the moneys not that big of an issue, I'd get the Bead locks. http://www.thewebwheeler.com/forums/images/smilies/m2c.gif

Well, I've decided to do all of my own cagework (as of today anyway). That's quite a chunk of change that won't be going out to someone else. I'm undecided on beadlocks still. Any leads on tires?

[Blanco]

Any leads on tires?

http://www.class3racing.com/showthread.php?t=28

[Yikes]

http://www.class3racing.com/showthread.php?t=28

I would buy those right now if they were 12.5's, but that extra inch really needs a 10" wide rim. I've heard good things about that tire.

[Yikes]

OK. I changed my mind. They're mine.